Tuesday, 15 January 2019

Some notes

I was nearly on the radio this morning, it was arranged by email. The programme researcher wanted people with different opinions of Brexit to come on and talk about what they thought of it all up to now. There is yet another vote tonight on Mrs Mays Deal, will it be Deal or No Deal?

I tuned in from 6am to listen to the programme, to hear what others had to say. I waited and waited, they couldn't give me a time when they would call me. The speakers were very eloquent in their analysis of what had gone on so far, and what would be the best outcome after the voting tonight. Some of it I agreed with and some of it I didn't. Everybody had their say.

I made some notes, so I could gather my thoughts together when it was my turn.

Why are they having yet another vote tonight?
Debate debate debate.
I didn't vote for a Deal, I voted OUT.
What has she been doing these last 2 + years?
Another referendum? We've had one, don't need another.
Why are they debating a Deal, we leave first, then plan a new UK.
Change. We need to be able to take control of our country.
We don't need to be chained to the EU.
I've had plenty of changes in my life, when something is not working - change it.
Don't be afraid of change, nothing stays the same.
We can work together to make a better UK
Too much bickering.
39 billion, don't pay it.
We can trade with the rest of the world.
Problems will be short term.
Too much scaremongering.
No Deal is fine. Lets get out now and negotiate later.

Time was ticking on, waiting for the phone call. When is it my turn?
The call came at 8.45am. Only 15 minutes left of the programme, they will be winding it down any time soon, last minute weather forecast, traffic report, what's coming on next after 9. I ignored the phone. Too late, I will only get a couple of minutes, and other people have already said some of what I was going to say. Not much point in repeating it. They probably won't ring me again, not bothered. I am just a gap filler.

Might as well post my notes here.
ilona

42 comments:

  1. Well said, Ilona!

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  2. As a remainder of French extraction it breaks my heart to see Europe in such turmoil and with so much bad feeling. I am proud to be European and not a little Englander, it is a totally class based decision, never have we been so divided as a nation, lost the ability to pull together, it is every person for themselves, our poor g.children are the ones who will suffer.

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  3. I disagree, I do think a second referendum is needed. People voted leave, but there was little or no sensible discussion on what leave meant.

    What is your solution to the Irish Border? What do you think about passporting for the banks?

    We can trade with the rest of the world? Of course we can, we do at the moment.

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    1. I choose not to answer your questions. This isn't a debate.

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  4. I voted out Ilona, and have never regretted it. By law we leave on 29 March at 11pm. It was a democratic vote and the government must see this through; no ifs, no buts. The UK can be independent and trade with whoever we wish and make our own laws without being shackled to the EU.

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    1. Would you care to share your solution for the Irish border, Amanda?

      Fred

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    2. Fred

      I have the right to my opinion as do 52% of the UK population; we were asked a question: do we leave or remain in the EU. The government has had 2 and half years to plan and negotiate our exit.

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    3. We are not debating Fred. People voted for Britain to leave the EU, simple as that.

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  5. I voted "leave" but would have respected the result if it'd gone the other way - unlike the "remoaners". Contrary to how leave voters were portrayed I don't sit in Wetherspoons all day, I did know why I wanted to leave and I am educated. To be free of the unelected EU bureaucrats was one of my reasons for voting out.

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  6. Hilde in Germany15 January 2019 at 17:33

    I am sorry that the UK wants to leave the EU. I don´t know how the outcome will be, but I liked the thought of a big European community.

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  7. I am interested whether you accounted and if how much in your budget for the rising prices? Also do you have any money set aside for for example dental care if you need it? I am now away from the UK and can see the rising prises when I come back every few months. Also we have already have to pay for our daughter to to go to a private GP twice because she was turned away from A&E, her GP had no appointments for weeks and they closed her local after hours walk in clinic. At the moment our extra bills are in the hundreds and we are shocked everytime we deal with the exchange rate how much less the pound buys. What I see is that whatever the outcome, Brexit is taking resources from all other stuff that the country needs to deal with and it looks that it will do so for some years to come. This leaves us all out of pocket.

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    1. Hi. Whatever price rises are ahead, I will cope with it. I don't keep separate accounts for different things. Prices go up all the time, sometimes by a few pennies, sometimes a few £'s. I am flexible with what I buy, I look for the best prices.

      I have money for dental care, check up once a year, £20 ish. I am registered with a National Health dentist, if any work needs doing which is outside the scope of the NH, I can pay private.

      I have access to see a National Health doctor, I can make an appointment, the surgery is two minutes walk from me. I am trying to stay healthy so I don't need to go, but if I have an emergency I can dial 999 and get an ambulance.

      I have an emergency fund to cover for anything that might crop up. I don't actually allocate money for different things, I just don't spend more than what is coming in, and so it mounts up. Over the years my bank balance has been steadily creeping up.

      I have money to pay for my cats, they are not insured. I could change my car tomorrow if I wanted to, but I won't because the one I have is perfectly fine. I have just paid my car insurance.

      21 years ago when I came here I was skint, all my money went into the house. Through very frugal spending I paid the mortgage off early.

      As I see it I will never be out of pocket, because I live within my means and only spend what I can afford to. I don't foresee any extra bills, but if I do get one I have money to cover it.

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  8. Linda, Teignmouth, S. Devon15 January 2019 at 18:45

    You have summed up my thoughts very succinctly Ilona. I'm in 100% agreement with you. However, if the vote had gone the other way I would have respected that result. That's what I understand by the word democracy. I cannot see the point of another referendum. What if we get the same or even a reverse of the percentages, do we then go for best of three! I know more than one person (OK - two) who voted remain but said they would definitely vote leave if they were asked again after seeing the way the EU has behaved in this debacle. The European Parliament is just a gravy train for failed MPs from their own countries. We can see from the mess in many other EU countries that it isn't working and we just need to take back control. Thankfully we didn't take up the Euro as our currency at a time when we were told the world as we know it would end if we didn't. Let's just finally get on with it.

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  9. Hi, the point is we are all entitled to our opinions, and the awful thing is that the original vote was completely divisive. 52% voted to leave; previously all constitutional affairs have required a two-thirds majority (like the first referendum in 1975) to change the constitution. This time we were given a simple "In or Out" choice, where no-one knew what the "Out" options would be. Or even that there would be options! It is no wonder that the country is divided; we were never given full information on what Brexit would mean, largely because no-one actually knew. It is no wonder that David Cameron has vanished; he has caused the most strife between the people of the UK in recent years, and I really worry what will happen next, whatever the result of tonight's vote.

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  10. I think one of the main points here is if a second vote is granted then that its the end if democracy. We can't keep voting because you don't like the outcome.

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    1. Well said, i voted leave and would vote the same again. If remain had won then i would of accepted it.

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  11. 100% agree with you Ilona. We saw the deceit in 1975 and they are trying to change the vote to remain today. Must be a lot of politicians paid by Europe to keep us in by the back door.

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  12. I voted Leave and I will never change my mind on that.This is what the majority voted for and that is what should have happened over 2 years ago!.I happen to care what is happening in this country and for the future of my grandchildren.xx

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  13. well, it has apparently happened, the "vote". and not gone smoothly. Do you have any suggestions/comments on what will be the next "steps" etc?

    I am far off (Canada), but I have to say, when Britain voted to join (long back) I was a bit shocked, and felt rather sad about it all. I felt that Britain was giving up much they had strived for "historically", and losing much control over its borders/lifestyle/values/etc...

    So much of what one hears (especially so far off as I am), is trash talk from media sources.

    Do you have any sort of feeling (just from talking with folks local to you), what the "real" average folks over there feel about it all?

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    1. Hi Suzy. I have no suggestions on what will happen next. It is out of my hands, I have no influence over the outcome, so I will not stress about it.

      I don't feel that Britain is giving up anything, I feel we have more to gain.

      I generally don't talk politics with real average folks. There are two friends where it has been briefly mentioned, one on each side, but no need to fall out about it. I have no idea what people around me think, that's their business.

      That's all I can say.

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  14. 100% in agreement with your 'notes'

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  15. The trouble is that many people who voted out did not consider the implications. The Irish border is just one issue, there are many more.

    People voted to “take back control”, were told that it would be easy. The fact that the majority of business leaders think leaving it a bad idea says a lot to me.

    It was ridiculous to condense a very complex issue down to a binary vote where one of the options was completely unknown. There are so many different versions of “out” - none of which were well articulated. The out campaign was basically “don’t listen to project fear”.

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    1. Here, here, people have forgotten the bombing campaigns in both NI and England.

      And as for 'control' I don't want to be controlled by a government in the control of big business - I want workers rights, animal welfare, and the environment protected.

      Yes, there are problems with the EU - maybe it was a mistake to enter it. But we are so entangled now The vote was so evenly split, and we have no idea what those who voted for any option were hoping for.
      The leave campaign promise various options, that contradicted each other.

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  16. I personally know not one person who voted to join the "common market" when the original vote was taken, when it was a much smaller group of countries. Certainly all my older relatives voted not to join, which was years before it became the massive EEC and current EU with all its attached red tape.

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  17. I'd like to think they're debating and having a vote about this deal for people like me :(
    I occasionally used to comment here. I'm the one who used to work on the docks in Hull but then moved to Germany because a member of my family was also there. It's been a great opportunity, living in a new evironment and something I don't want to end.
    But if we leave the EU without a deal, then our status is in major jeopardy. Are we allowed to stay in Germany? Do we have any rights? Are we allowed to access the pension funds we've been paying into? The only way such things will be cleared up in a way which doesn't destroy our lives, is if a deal is done.
    Maybe you aren't aware of such situations when you say "just get out on March 29th without a deal and we'll talk later"? If you are aware of these situations, then it genuinely hurts to see good folk being so uncaring.

    Of course the vore itself was completely democratic and while I voted remain because of the amazing opportunities given to young people to travel and work abroad in new environments and the EU's protection of consumer and employee rights - something the UK government can definitely not be trusted with - I undrstand those that voted to leave beacause of the unelected bureaurats or the EU's appaling treatment of Greece.

    But please, understand how damaging leaving without a deal would be for people like me.

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  18. what a mess the politicians have made. they wanted a referendum; they got one; the answer was to leave. that's it surely. unfortunately not when some mp's decided that their own opinions were more important than the people who voted them in. what a shameful situation.

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  19. Today I heard that the EU are ruling as to what height our letter boxes should be on our front doors....70cm they are saying. I think protection from dogs was mentioned. I cannot believe what I'm hearing ...they are dictating as to what height a letter box should be on my front door ??? The UK seemed to manage quite well before we were dictated to...didn't we? We do not need the EU.

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    1. The EU is not foisting that on the UK, the Communications Worker's Union (UK) has been calling for that European Standard to be added to building regs:
      "The Communications Workers Union has been campaigning to outlaw low level letterboxes for many years. The CWU has been striving for the European Standard (EN13724) to be added to UK Building Regulations - this requires that letterboxes should be positioned at a suitably accessible height, accessible to postal delivery workers, significantly reducing possible injuries such as, dog bites, fingers being trapped or back strain caused when bending excessively to reach ground level boxes."
      "Sadly, successive UK governments both Conservative and Labour have rejected our call to amend the regulations. This was despite the fact that both the HSE (Health and Safety Executive) and Royal Mail supported the Union's Campaign and the fact that we gained the support of over 100 MPs from all Parties who signed an Early Day Motion to the government supporting the CWU."
      https://www.cwu.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/18LTB082-Low-Level-Letter-Boxes-and-Re-Launch-of-the-CWU-Low-Level-Letter-Box-Campaign.pdf

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    2. Ros Thank you for that I hadn't realised it was an issue. I do like your choice of word " foisting" as I know we have already had many things foisted upon us by the EU. I'm assuming there will still be many older properties with historic doors that will be exempt if it ever goes through and the "European Standard" will return to being the good old ""British Standard"" ...yay!!! I'll drink to that!

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  20. I was saddened and disappointed by the vote in 2016 particularly as many of the people who voted leave may not live long enough to see the real consequences. As a remainer I feel Europe has a lot to offer and really value the freedom of movement. I dread a return to the insular little England I grew up with and would happily leave the UK if I wasn’t too old to get a job elsewhere. Sadly I’m stuck here living with the outcome of a result I didn’t vote for and don’t agree with. To make matters worse I’m seen as being part of the age group who voted leave and tarred with the same brush. I’m not sure whether a second referendum would achieve a different result and wonder about the consequences if it did.

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  21. Lets have a people's vote. No goodbyes based on lies!

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  22. Some comments have been deleted.

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  23. Live you post, I find it interesting but not too high brow for me ☺☺

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    1. Sorry that should say love,I am using a tiny tablet and sometimes miss type☺☺

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  24. I think the saddest thing for me about the whole Brexit situation is how badly informed we were before the vote in 2016. We were all asked to vote with little to no real information about what the effects would be.

    And now both sides are standing in corners yelling at each other and not listening to each others concerns or collaborating on an exit strategy that will have as little disturbance as possible to most people's lives.

    I'm not too worries about my own personal situation - I own my flat, I've got savings and assets, a good job (at least for the next couple of years!), potentially good pensions and two allotments so I should be able to ride out any short to medium term disruption. But I think there are an awful lot of people who are going to find themselves in serious difficulty.

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    1. Agree - but then a comparitively low quality of life is what we're used to in the UK. When we travel we can see this.

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  25. A reminder. Anonymous comments are not accepted and will be deleted.

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  26. To all of the posters on here wether you voted Remain or Leave or you like Mrs May or not ...the negotiators representing the EU have treated Mrs May abysmally in the last few months. She is our Prime Minister and represents us and the UK and deserves much better respect whilst trying to do her job.

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  27. I'd strongly urge people to look at the veiws of the Europeans. There is alot of unrest out there. It isn't just Britain. The Germans have been rioting, the French are being shot at for protesting, economies are failing. If we remain we are going to be part of a very big sinking ship. I'm very pro Europe, I'm anti the EU machine and its lack of democracy.

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    1. KWalker...I agree with you. There is a lot of "sinking" going down, and Britain could easily get sucked in. (I am over in Canada). It is sort of the thought I had when they (Britain) first "joined". That, plus the huge loss of personal (British) borders/will/identity/etc …

      --- pretty soon, if all these countries are free borders/same money/free travel/same laws/etc...What exactly is the point of even calling (naming) them different countries? Seems like they will blend into one....one what, though? And when that happens, what will be the point of tourists travelling to each different one? They will end up being same/very similar. Seems sad. Personally hope it goes back.

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  28. Agree with you Ilona, we managed fine before we were 'in' and we weren't consulted about joining at the start (I think it had all been planned since the war). There are countries outside the EU queuing up to trade with us and the EU don't like it. Everyone who is worried about what life will be like without membership...that was what it felt like for those who did not feel comfortable being herded together in the first place.

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